Proposition 8 the Musical

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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby WarrenSensei » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:36 pm

Yeah, I saw this the other day, and it would be hilarious if it weren't so true.

This article in The Advocate has a lot of the background story, and is very telling about how and why Prop 8 passed. http://www.advocate.com/exclusive_detail_ektid67815.asp
"I must not fear.
Fear is the little death that brings total oblivion.
I will face my fear;
I will allow it to pass over me and through me,
and when I turn to see fear's path
there will be nothing.
Only I will remain."
-Frank Herbert
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby Joshua » Sun Dec 07, 2008 5:35 pm

I was saddened by the racist tone some people have taken, i.e., it was as much the fault of African-American voters as Mormons. Frankly, it was a LOT of people's faults, on both sides of the fence, that this thing got passed. Ultimately, I'm confident equal rights will prevail, but this was just so very, very sad.

Jack Black, however, is teh funnee. :)

- Joshua
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby WarrenSensei » Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:59 am

I know what you mean. The exit polls suggest that the effect of old age was more important than race in Prop 8's passing, but the race was so close that the error in exit polls is quite a bit larger than what it's trying to account for, so we can't point a finger at anyone in particular.

The problem is that a finger needs pointing. Our (mundane and not) society needs to be convicted of their bigotry regardless of it's causes. Of course, as the article in The Advocate points out, the fault for prop 8 passing lies squarely in *our* collective lap, as LGBT's and allies. We were complacent, trusting that the arc of history would take care of the difference for us. That's how things went in every other location in the world that made the move to gay marriage, and we all assumed that a normal campaign defending ourselves against the attacks would be sufficient. And we were wrong, and must now fight to atone for that error in collective judgment, no matter how far away from CA we are.

~George Benedict
"I must not fear.
Fear is the little death that brings total oblivion.
I will face my fear;
I will allow it to pass over me and through me,
and when I turn to see fear's path
there will be nothing.
Only I will remain."
-Frank Herbert
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby Demon_Rider » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:08 am

Well the one thing we can take comfort in is that when Prop 22(?) passed, it was by a much larger margin. When prop h8 is overturned, and it will be, and they try to ban it again by popular vote, if the trend stays as it is, it will fail, and we will have some measure of equality at last.

We homo's really need to start hunting biggots of voting age. Some people shouldn't have a voice just for their pure stupidity.
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby Thomas Gryffyth » Tue Dec 16, 2008 12:08 pm

Funny video. I enjoyed it greatly and it's on my facebook page.
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby IgnatiusBaeticus » Tue Dec 16, 2008 1:01 pm

WarrenSensei wrote:Of course, as the article in The Advocate points out, the fault for prop 8 passing lies squarely in *our* collective lap, as LGBT's and allies. We were complacent, trusting that the arc of history would take care of the difference for us. That's how things went in every other location in the world that made the move to gay marriage, and we all assumed that a normal campaign defending ourselves against the attacks would be sufficient.


Salve. I know nothing on USA's LGBT movement, but am Spanish, and married by law 3 three years ago, after many years of coupled life without any right. So, according to Spanish experience, Warren is right: one cannot hope success from an campaign linked to an actual fact. Only 30 years ago, homo and trans were comdemned by law (there were two prisons devoted to this kind of "criminals"); today we're married. The way has been an everlasting campaign, not even limited to Pride Day (though this is the largest demonstration every year in Spain since almost 10 years), and many people living normally in spite of all.

But i think those things (permanent campaign, living together) also occur in the USA. Am i wrong? So? Last month, as i followed the course of the presidential election in the USA, i was surprised that they have to be voted such things as individual rights. These last are not voted here. Personal rights, i mean. They're taken for granted when you happen to have a progressive government, and when a conservative one succeeds it, it uses not to revoke achieved rights. Hope it will be so also with homo marriage. The point is that individual rights are not to be held on majority: they're self-evident.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

Hope you manage to obtain them, even not only in CA. Yes, you can!
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. Declaration of Independence, 1776.
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Re: Proposition 8 the Musical

Postby Demon_Rider » Tue Dec 16, 2008 11:33 pm

The sad thing is that it passed in California. One of the most liberal states in the country. I've got to say I'm surprised NY hasn't had the same issues yet considering it seems everything that either of the states do, the other soon follows suit.
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